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Prijateljstvo, druženje i ostale radosti socijalizacije

Moderatori: IriS, Moderators

Korisnikov avatar
By unic0rn
#227977
Izdvojicu:
Sexuality is a part of a person which cannot be removed and looked at
separately from all other parts.
By Бреее!!!
#228056
Originally posted by unic0rn
A na ovoj strani, http://www.wpro.who.int/pdf/pub/33/module4.pdf
Svetska Zdravstvena Organizacija ne klasifikuje homosexualnost kao bolest nego kao nesto sasvim normalno.
sta kazu za homofobiju, ima li kakav doca ovde koji zna gde se to nalazi u dokunetima SZO ?!? :sluske:

:zastava: :zastava: :zastava:
Korisnikov avatar
By Abyss
#228137
Originally posted by unic0rn
Originally posted by Abyss
1. Ukoliko nisi pratio razvoj dogaðaja, a nisi, ja uporno pokušavam da pokažem da ne treba sve uzeti kao egzaktan izvor informacija. To sam i pokazao (prelistaj malo).

2. Trebalo bi malo da pro?itaš poruke u odeljku coming out, i sve ?e ti biti jasno.

3. Ko vama brani da pokazujete svoje odlike? Mi smo protiv toga, a vama, a ni meni ne može niko ništa da zabrani.
1. Pa onda nista ne mozemo tvrditi sa sigurnoscu, zar ne ? :)
Dakle ne preterujmo, kada neke vesti prenese ceo svet, pogotovo sto su banalne kao ova, sigurno je nije neko izmislio.

2. ne ne, samo ti dokazi.

3. Branite vi, pretnjama, shikaniranjem, prebijanjem redovnim ....
1. Ako se nešto svrstava u banalno, onda to ne prenose vesti celog sveta, zar ne? 2. Stvara obdojnost prema roditeljima, bra?om sestrom, nestabilnost u društvu. 3. I meni brane da otmem nekom de?ku devojku pretnjama, prebijanjem, pa se ja i dalje viðam sa njom.
Korisnikov avatar
By unic0rn
#228161
Originally posted by Abyss
Originally posted by unic0rn
Originally posted by Abyss
1. Ukoliko nisi pratio razvoj dogaðaja, a nisi, ja uporno pokušavam da pokažem da ne treba sve uzeti kao egzaktan izvor informacija. To sam i pokazao (prelistaj malo).

2. Trebalo bi malo da pro?itaš poruke u odeljku coming out, i sve ?e ti biti jasno.

3. Ko vama brani da pokazujete svoje odlike? Mi smo protiv toga, a vama, a ni meni ne može niko ništa da zabrani.
1. Pa onda nista ne mozemo tvrditi sa sigurnoscu, zar ne ? :)
Dakle ne preterujmo, kada neke vesti prenese ceo svet, pogotovo sto su banalne kao ova, sigurno je nije neko izmislio.

2. ne ne, samo ti dokazi.

3. Branite vi, pretnjama, shikaniranjem, prebijanjem redovnim ....

1. Ako se nešto svrstava u banalno, onda to ne prenose vesti celog sveta, zar ne?
2. Stvara obdojnost prema roditeljima, bra?om sestrom, nestabilnost u društvu.
3. I meni brane da otmem nekom de?ku devojku pretnjama, prebijanjem, pa se ja i dalje viðam sa njom.
1. Uhvatio si se za najbanalniji deo rechenice, josh ga i izvrces -> nedostatak argumenata.
Mislio sam da je vest o gej pingvinima mnogo manje vazna u odnosu na cunami ili aushvic. To sam podrazumevao pod banalno.

2. Ne znam po kom osnovu homosexualizam, ocenjen od Svetske Zdravstvene Organizacije i Americkog Udruzenja Psihologa i Psihijatara kao nesto sasvim normalno i prirodno, ugrozava bilo sta od toga sto si naveo. Istrazi malo da li je u Holandiji na primer, Australiji i sl. negde nesto ugrozeno?

3. Mi nikome nista ne otimamo.
Drugo vidjamo se i mi. Ali zelimo da obzirom da ne ugrozavamo nikako, nikome nista ne otimamo i slicno, bez pretnji i prebijanja zivimo svoj zivot onako kako smo odredjeni da ga zivimo, ukljucujuci i otvoreno pokazivanje nashe sexualnosti.
Korisnikov avatar
By Abyss
#228218
Originally posted by unic0rn

1. Uhvatio si se za najbanalniji deo rechenice, josh ga i izvrces -> nedostatak argumenata.
Mislio sam da je vest o gej pingvinima mnogo manje vazna u odnosu na cunami ili aushvic. To sam podrazumevao pod banalno.

2. Ne znam po kom osnovu homosexualizam, ocenjen od Svetske Zdravstvene Organizacije i Americkog Udruzenja Psihologa i Psihijatara kao nesto sasvim normalno i prirodno, ugrozava bilo sta od toga sto si naveo. Istrazi malo da li je u Holandiji na primer, Australiji i sl. negde nesto ugrozeno?

3. Mi nikome nista ne otimamo.
Drugo vidjamo se i mi. Ali zelimo da obzirom da ne ugrozavamo nikako, nikome nista ne otimamo i slicno, bez pretnji i prebijanja zivimo svoj zivot onako kako smo odredjeni da ga zivimo, ukljucujuci i otvoreno pokazivanje nashe sexualnosti.
1. Pa to i ja upravo pokušavam da ti objasnim da je vest o gej pingvinima banalnija od cunamija. Shodno tome, zašto bi vesti širom sveta bavile vama kada je to isto toliko banalno.
Nedostatak argumenata ?????

2. Ja nisam spomenuo nikakvu organizaciju, niti bilo kakav zakon. Ja sam ti spomenuo šta je realnost, a ne nekakav papir.

3. I ja imam duga?ku kosu, slušam Rammstein-a i tražim svoja prava da me niko nikada ne tu?e zato što sam to ja !!!!
I tražim da se izglasa zakon da cela Srbija mora da sluša samo Rammstein-a !!!!!
Korisnikov avatar
By Noctis Lucis Caelum
#228321
Mislim, šta re?i a ne ispasti glup. Ova rasprava ne vodi nikuda. Znam da ?ete me napasti zbog ovoga što ?u re?i ali odgovorno tvrdim da ni jedna ni druga strana nisu u pravu. Ovo je preslikana pri?a o dva ovna koja su htela da preðu preko balvana. Homofobi napadaju, homoseksualcu se brane pa napadaju, ima li tome kraja? O?igledno nema jer ni jedna strana nije voljna da popusti. Nasilje raða još nasilja jer nijedna strana ne želi da popusti.

Homoseksualci! Seks izmeðu dva muškarca ili dve žene nije normalan, pa vi pri?ajte šta želite. Ja li?no sam protivnik gay parada. Ja prvi ne volim kad mi neko nabija stvari na nos, pa ?ak iako to nisu, ja parade doživljavam kao provokaciju. Ponekad stvari i u najboljoj nameri ne izaðu na dobro. Nemojte više isticati svoju razli?itost, po ?emu ste to razli?iti? Šta, imate ?etri ruke, pet nogu? Nemojte udarati glavom o zid, tako ne?ete rešiti ništa ve? ?ete samo sebi nabaciti još ve?e probleme.

Heteroseksualci! Zašto se toliko plašite homoseksualizma? Izvinite, ali ja ne verujem u pri?u o zabrinutosti da li ?e deca biti normalna ako se homoseksualizam dozvoli. Milslim 'dozvoli'. Možda bi vam i poverovao da živim na nekoj drugoj planeti, ali nije tako. Homoseksualizam je genetski deformitet, zna?i, homoseksualizam je delimi?no i nasledna bolest. Pa zar ne shvatate da vašim proganjanjem homoseksualaca primoravate ih da ulaze u bra?ne veze i da prave decu koja ?e nositi te iste gene koje oni imaju? Pa vi ste krivi što se homoseksualizam proširio toliko. Kakva bela kuga, zabranite onda abortuse, znate li koliko abortusa se obavlja u ovoj zemlji? A što je još bitnije, znate li kako se abortusi vrše? Pa nije li to najgnusije što ljudsko bi?e može da uradi? Muškarci heteroseksualci, šta vama smeta što se neki mladi? ljubi sa de?kom, šta to vama smeta, pa nije li time vama smanjena konkurencija? Više devojaka ostaje za vas. (Zar ovo ne podse?a na životinjske horde?) Ok, homoseksualnost nije normalna, i šta s tim? Da li treba tu?i osobu koja ima rak, koja ima sidu, koja je invalid? Da li treba zabraniti invalidima da koriste invalidska kolica? Ne vidim šta vas to toliko ugrožava pa ste toliko zabrinuti.

Pravoslavci! (obra?am se vama jer druge religije ne poznajem i izvinjavam im se zbog toga) Pa šta se vi brinete zbog tuðeg greha? Nije li sam Hrist stao u odbranu prostitutke koju su hteli da lin?uju? Pravoslavlje treba da propoveda ljubav, a svako neka se brine o svom grehu. Svestan sam svega što sam radio, svih vrlina i mana, za svoje grehe ?u da odgovaram samo ja. 'Gledaš trun u oku bližnjeg svog a u svom gredu ne vidiš'. Niko na ovom svetu nije bezgrešan. Nemate prava da prisiljavate bilo koga da to bude, jer samo je jedna osoba bezgrešna i savršena, a to je Gospod Bog Otac. Svaki roditelj voli svoje dete, bez obzira na to kakvo je, pa i Gospod voli svu svoju decu. Naravno, sve ima svoje granice, ali nemojte mene proglašavati grešnikom jer me Vi vidite kao grešnika. O svojim gresima ja ?u odgovarati jedinom pravom sudiji koji ima prava da mi sudi i osudi ili pomiluje.

Za kraj ?u apelovati da uklju?ite razum i srce, da pokrenete humanost u sebi. Niste sami na ovom svetu, mnogo ljudi je sa vama, probajte da živite sa njima. Zaboravite na podele jer u suštini, svi smo mi isti. Spustite svoj ego, živite i pustite druge da žive. Svet bi bio mnogo bolje mesto samo kad bi se nau?ili ljubavi. A to je jedina istina, jedina Božja staza, jedini na?in da ova planeta preživi. Izvinjavam se na duga?kom tekstu i hvala što ste imali nerava da pro?itate ovo. Još jednom apelujem na vašu humanost, i heteroseksualaca i homoseksualaca i vernika i nevernika. Ostavite se meðusobnih svaða i pokušajte da u?inite svet boljim mestom za život. Jer ovde ne?ete živeti samo vi, uskoro ?e do?i nova pokolenja, nove genracije. A šta im mi ostavljamo u nasleðe?
Korisnikov avatar
By HARP
#228351
Ma šta se femkate više,šta ima da im objašnjavam,ne?u da mi se vataju i cma?u po ulicama homoseksualci i kraj.
Kažite mi bar jedan dobar razlog zašto bi "trebalo" da se žvalavite na sred grada.
Korisnikov avatar
By HARP
#228370
Originally posted by NeoDaemon
gox, tako mi se o?e! :sekirica:
Pa ti kad nemaš grižu savest izvadi?eš ga i piša?eš na sred trotoara i ko zna šta sve još što ti se ho?e!!!
Ja sam uvek hteo da se skinem u ga?e i šetam ulicom kad je nemogu?a vru?ina leti,ali to nisam u?inio,razumeš što?
Korisnikov avatar
By Super Mario
#228436
Originally posted by unic0rn

Homosexuality is not a mental or emotional disorder.

The research on homosexuality is very clear. Homosexuality is neither
mental illness nor moral depravity.
It is simply the way a minority of
our population expresses human love and sexuality. Study after study
documents the mental health of gay men and lesbians. Studies of
judgment, stability, reliability, and social and vocational adaptiveness
all show that gay men and lesbians function every bit as well as
heterosexuals.

~ The American Psychiatric Association and The American Psychological
Association, July 1994
Treba overiti celu ovu stranu:
http://www.christiangays.com/articles/facts.shtml
A ja taman pomislio da ce pederi na svom sajtu napisati da su nenormalni. Unicorne, link ti je irelevantan. Ali hajde, prokomentarisacu, sve da je i tako kao sto pishe, vazhi samo za SAD, a u americi je sve moguce uz malo (vishe) para! :burner:
Korisnikov avatar
By Goran Smith
#228559
Originally posted by Super Mario
A ja taman pomislio da ce pederi na svom sajtu napisati da su nenormalni. Unicorne, link ti je irelevantan. Ali hajde, prokomentarisacu, sve da je i tako kao sto pishe, vazhi samo za SAD, a u americi je sve moguce uz malo (vishe) para! :burner:
Originally posted by unic0rn
A na ovoj strani, http://www.wpro.who.int/pdf/pub/33/module4.pdf
Svetska Zdravstvena Organizacija ne klasifikuje homosexualnost kao bolest nego kao nesto sasvim normalno.
:P
Korisnikov avatar
By unic0rn
#228578
Originally posted by Abyss
Originally posted by unic0rn

1. Uhvatio si se za najbanalniji deo rechenice, josh ga i izvrces -> nedostatak argumenata.
Mislio sam da je vest o gej pingvinima mnogo manje vazna u odnosu na cunami ili aushvic. To sam podrazumevao pod banalno.

2. Ne znam po kom osnovu homosexualizam, ocenjen od Svetske Zdravstvene Organizacije i Americkog Udruzenja Psihologa i Psihijatara kao nesto sasvim normalno i prirodno, ugrozava bilo sta od toga sto si naveo. Istrazi malo da li je u Holandiji na primer, Australiji i sl. negde nesto ugrozeno?

3. Mi nikome nista ne otimamo.
Drugo vidjamo se i mi. Ali zelimo da obzirom da ne ugrozavamo nikako, nikome nista ne otimamo i slicno, bez pretnji i prebijanja zivimo svoj zivot onako kako smo odredjeni da ga zivimo, ukljucujuci i otvoreno pokazivanje nashe sexualnosti.
1. Pa to i ja upravo pokušavam da ti objasnim da je vest o gej pingvinima banalnija od cunamija. Shodno tome, zašto bi vesti širom sveta bavile vama kada je to isto toliko banalno.
Nedostatak argumenata ?????

2. Ja nisam spomenuo nikakvu organizaciju, niti bilo kakav zakon. Ja sam ti spomenuo šta je realnost, a ne nekakav papir.

3. I ja imam duga?ku kosu, slušam Rammstein-a i tražim svoja prava da me niko nikada ne tu?e zato što sam to ja !!!!
I tražim da se izglasa zakon da cela Srbija mora da sluša samo Rammstein-a !!!!!

1. Ne. Moja poenta je sasvim drugacija - toga ima i u prirodi. Vrednost vesti, konkretna vest - sve se to apstrahuje i ostaje srz: homosexualnosti ima i u prirodi, ne samo kod ljudi. Ona postoji, i ne moze se promeniti. Ona nije bolest, ona nije poremecaj.

2. Argumentuj tu svoju realnost koje su dve svetski znacajne organizacije previdele.

3. A ne. Opet izvrces!!
Ne trazimo mi da cela srbija bude homosexualna.
Dalje, niko nikog nece prebiti jer ima dugu kosu i slusa ramstajn - ja bar za to nisam chuo do sad.
I ne radi se o necemu kao sto je duga kosa ili slusanje muzike, nego odlika jednog broja ljudi, jedino zajednicko je da niko ne treba da bude diskriminisan ni zbog muzike koju slusa, ni zbog boje kose, ni zbog svoje sexualnosti. Napominjem da razdvajam sustinu muzickog ukusa, i estetskog utiska i ne poistovecujem ih sa sexualnoscu!
Korisnikov avatar
By unic0rn
#228579
Originally posted by Super Mario
Originally posted by unic0rn

Homosexuality is not a mental or emotional disorder.

The research on homosexuality is very clear. Homosexuality is neither
mental illness nor moral depravity.
It is simply the way a minority of
our population expresses human love and sexuality. Study after study
documents the mental health of gay men and lesbians. Studies of
judgment, stability, reliability, and social and vocational adaptiveness
all show that gay men and lesbians function every bit as well as
heterosexuals.

~ The American Psychiatric Association and The American Psychological
Association, July 1994
Treba overiti celu ovu stranu:
http://www.christiangays.com/articles/facts.shtml
A ja taman pomislio da ce pederi na svom sajtu napisati da su nenormalni. Unicorne, link ti je irelevantan. Ali hajde, prokomentarisacu, sve da je i tako kao sto pishe, vazhi samo za SAD, a u americi je sve moguce uz malo (vishe) para! :burner:
To je izvod iz zakljucaka Americke bla bla ... Nije to neki peder napisao jer mu se tako prohtelo i potpisao chitavu instituciju.
TI ako sumnjas nadji oficijelni sajt iste pa demantuj.

Da, sacemo da krenemo s gej lobijem?
Mislim da u vezi homosexualnosti nisu koriscene pare nego struka tih ljudi. U pirlog kazujem chinjenicu da americka administracija (poznata po legalnom lobiranju, nelegalnoj potplativosti) nije ozvanichila gay brakove i protivit se tome. Da je neko platio, valjda bi isli do kraja.
Uzgred, goran ti je dao drugi sajt, SVETSKE Zdravstvene Organizacije koja kaze to isto...
By Gost
#228588
Originally posted by Abyss
Ljudi, niko još do sada, govorim uopšteno, nije pokazao kako se dolazi do istine, i da li je to istinska istina, da li ona ima svoju težinu....
Ovo je, valjda, poslednji "argument" homofoba, Abyss, ne istrcavaj unapred. Crkva ce se javiti sa jos malo sranja, malo kasnije. Poenta je edukacija, ne skrecite sa teme i nastavite da se svadjate. Od ovog moze da se napravi divna brosura koja ce se deliti po zurkama kao kondomi (plus je zabavna). Ima mnogo neprosvecenih pedera i lezbejki (koji su uz to autohomofobicni), daklem ...

a sto za nas devojke ne delite folije po zurkama? :nerd:

IDEMO DALJE .........................................
By Çâðê_DUP
#228599
Originally posted by unic0rn
Treba overiti celu ovu stranu:
http://www.christiangays.com/articles/facts.shtml
Hriscanski gejevi? Ovo je apsurdno!

I videh i gle! Siilan vetar dolazashe sa severa i velik oblak i oganj koji se razgorevashe i oko njega gnev boziji, a usred ognja jaka svetlost i to bese Gospod Bog, pored njega kao cetiri zivotinje oni sto semena muska van zene svoje na istopolna prosipashe, to behaju gresnici sodomasti koji na ochi behu nalik na coveka i noge im bejahu prave, a u stopalu behu im noge kao u teleta i sevahu kao ugladjena med. Tako i vi sijate homoseksualci, a stopala vam odaju greh.

Gresnici, pokrijte lica pred prizorom Svesilnoga, jer ste nemocni da podnesete munju njegova gneva koja se odapinje sa trona bozjijeg :meduza: kao i blistanje koje se odasilje otud. Ta blistanja, svetlost, munja celom svetu pokazuju na bezakonje vase i sramotu svoju ne mozete prikriti. Gospod vas moli da se pokajete jer ne zeli svoju decu koja su se sva rodjenjem prokazala u Hristu da baci na muke vechne! Pokajte se, dok jos nije kasno!

Sam naziv sajta kristijan gejs govori da to nije od boga napisano. Djavo je mudar.I uchi vas odgovorima.

Al andio bozji silazi s neba:sw:ovako cete se provesti!
By Çâðê_DUP
#228604
Originally posted by kal zakath
Obrazlozenje: Prema saznanjima suda hriscansko verovanje prihvaca otprilike jedna trecina svetske populacije. To automatski znaci da argumenti tuzece strane ne vaze za 2/3 svetske populacije i kao takvi nemaju nikakvu vrednost.
To je sud djavla. Sveto pismo je direktno od Boga napisano, a to sto 2/3 gresnika ne veruje, oni ce u pakao ici i to nije problem crkve osim da ih na pravi put vrati. Bas zato sto je toliko mulja i taloga na zemlji, Gospod se sprema da svet unisti jer je to seme zita bacheno u zemlju donelo kukolj. Vera je coveku urodjena. Kad je nema, djavo je umesao prste u to. Ne dokazuje vera postojanje bozje,ali se ona dokazuje njime, jer polazi od njega. Eto vam dokaza. I sad? Sta cete sad? Ne bojite se pakla? MOzda negirate Veru? A ona je osnov svega cemu se nadamo, potvrda stvari nevidljivih, znaci POSTOJI! u tROJICI SE POJMI PRIRODA I ZIVE PUNOCOM, ali nisu iz iste prirode, vec su iste prirode. A kakve veze VI imate s prirodom?
Korisnikov avatar
By Goran Smith
#228983
The Bible
In our Judeo-Christian society, the documents collectively known as the Bible serve as the primary guide on most issues. It is interesting that many Christians take literally the references to homosexual acts, while interpreting other text with great flexibility. One person reported listening to a nationally-known woman speak in her campaign against homosexuality. She spent quite a bit of time quoting impressively from Leviticus. The listener accepted much of what the speaker said until he realized that, by Levitical standards, the crusader herself had broken many biblical laws - she spoke in church (1 Corinthians 14:34), she taught men (1 Timothy 2:12), she was wearing a dress made of cotton and polyester (Deuteronomy 22:11), and others of which he was probably unaware.

What does the Bible really say about homosexuality? Actually, very little. Most significantly, Jesus said nothing at all. Considering the relatively small amount of attention the Bible pays to the subject, we must ask ourselves why this is such a volatile issue. Other subjects about which the scriptures say a great deal (e.g. judgment, pride, hypocrisy) receive much less passionate attention. Before looking at specific passages, it is important to note that everyone understands the scriptures based on, and through, the light of what they have been taught. The Bible was not written in a cultural void, and many of its instructions and laws are simply classified as less relevant today (e.g. prohibition against eating pork).

Nowhere does the Bible actually address the idea of persons being lesbian or gay. The statements are, without exception, directed to certain homosexual acts. Early writers had no understanding of homosexuality as a psychosexual orientation. That truth is a relatively recent discovery. The biblical authors were referring to homosexual acts performed by persons they assumed were heterosexuals.

The Sodom Story
A chief text used to condemn homosexuality is the Sodom story (Genesis 19:1-29), often interpreted as showing God's abhorrence of homosexuality. In the story, two angels, in the form of men, are sent to the home of Lot in Sodom. While they are there, the men of the city "both young and old, surrounded the house - everyone without exception" and demanded that the visitors be brought out "so that we might know them." (Genesis 19: 4-5) Lot begged the men to leave his guests alone and take his daughters instead. The men of the city became angry and stormed the door. As a result, they were all struck blind by the angels.

There are several problems with the traditional interpretation of this passage. Whether or not the intent of the men of Sodom was sexual, the inhospitality and injustice coming from the mob, and that generally characterized the community, were "the sin of Sodom." (Ezekial 16:49-50, Isaiah 13:19, Jeremiah 49:18; 50:40) Jesus himself refers to the inhospitality of Sodom. (Luke 10:10-13) If the men were indeed homosexuals, then why would Lot offer them his daughters? What is threatened here is rape. The significant point, then, is that all rape is considered horrible by God. The story deserves another reading.

It should be noted that not all of the men of Sodom could have been homosexual or there would have been no need to destroy them. If they had all been homosexuals, they would have all died off leaving no heirs. Quite likely, they were a mixed group of evil men attempting to be abusive to people who were different. Ironically, lesbian and gay people are often the victim of that same sin.
Although the traditional interpretation of the Sodom story fails as an argument against homosexuality, there are several other Old Testament passages that do condemn homosexual acts. Again, it should be noted that these passages do not deal with same-sex orientation nor is there any reference to genital love between lesbian or gay persons.

Homosexual Acts
Of thousands of Old Testament passages, only two make explicit reference to homosexual acts: Leviticus 18:22 and Leviticus 20:13. Both of these passages are a part of the Levitical holiness code, which is not kept by any Christian group. If it was enforced, almost every Christian would be excommunicated or executed. It has been logically argued that science and progress have made many of the Levitical laws irrelevant. For example, fundamentalist author Tim LaHaye states that, although Levitical laws prohibit intercourse during menstruation, medical authorities do not view it as harmful, and, therefore, it should not be viewed as sinful. He further explains, "Those laws were given 3,500 years ago before showers and baths were convenient, before tampons, disinfectants and other improved means of sanitation had been invented." (The Act of Marriage, p.275) With that, LaHaye makes this law irrelevant and rightly so. Ironically, though, in his book, The Unhappy Gay, the Levitical laws are one of the chief cornerstones of his arguments. Much of the holiness code is now irrelevant for us as moral law. Thus, having children, which was of exceptional importance to the early Hebrews, is now made less relevant by overpopulation, just as the prohibition against eating pork and shellfish has been made irrelevant by refrigeration.

The Bible never addresses the issue of homosexual love, yet it does have several beautiful examples of same-sex love. David's love for Jonathan was said to exceed his love for women. (2 Samuel 1:26) Ruth's relationship with Naomi is an example of a deep, bonding love, and Ruth's words of covenant to Naomi are often used in heterosexual wedding ceremonies. (Ruth 1:16-17) The Bible clearly values love between persons of the same sex.

Jesus' Attitude
In the New Testament there is no record of Jesus saying anything about homosexuality. This ought to strike us as very odd in light of the great threat to Christianity, family life and the American way that some would have us believe homosexuality is. Jesus saw injustice and religious hypocrisy as a far greater threat to the Realm of God.

Episcopal priest Dr. Tom Horner has written that the Gospels imply in two places that Jesus' attitude toward lesbians and gays would not have been hostile. (Jonathan Loved David, p. 122) The first is found in the story of Jesus healing the Centurion's servant. (Matthew 8:5-13) The word used for the servant is "pais," which in the Greek culture referred to a younger lover of an older, more powerful or educated man. Clearly, the story demonstrates an unusually intense love, and Jesus' response was wholly positive.

The other hint of Jesus' attitude is seen in his comments about eunuchs. (Matthew 19:10-12) Jesus opposed divorce in opposition to the abuses experienced by women. It is in the context of marriage that Jesus said "some eunuchs were born so; others had been made eunuchs and still others choose to be eunuchs for the Kingdom's sake." Jesus' remarks about celibacy and castration are clear, but a male child being born without testicles is a rare birth defect. It is only in our day that the Kinsey Institute has demonstrated that sexual orientation is likely determined prior to birth. It could well be that those to whom Jesus refers as being "born eunuchs" are the people we call lesbian or gay.

Jesus' attitude toward eunuchs differed greatly from the fundamentalist Pharisees of his day. To them, eunuchs should have been excluded from the covenant and barred from worship and participating in the community of faith. Jesus' graceful approach to eunuchs is beautifully pictured in the promise of the prophecy of Isaiah, "To the eunuchs...I will give them an everlasting name that will not be taken away." (56:4-8)

In Jesus' day there were three types of persons called eunuchs: celibates, those who were slaves and were castrated so that children would not be born to them, and those who were "born eunuchs," or homosexuals. Royal and wealthy households used castrated slaves to work with and guard the concubines and female slaves. However, when assigning slaves to female members of the royal family, they would choose homosexual slaves. With female members, the concern was not just unwanted pregnancies but also rape.

It is against this background that we must read the story found in Acts 8:26-40. In this passage, the Holy Spirit sends Philip the Deacon to witness to and baptize an Ethiopian eunuch of Queen Candace of Ethiopia. One of the earliest converts to Christianity was a person excluded for sexual reasons from the Old Testament community.

Paul's References
Paul's statement in Romans 1:18-32 has been taken as the strongest New Testament rejection of homosexuality. He is concerned about the influence of the pagan culture on the Roman Christians. After giving a detailed description of a world that "exchanged the truth of God for a lie and worshipped and served created things rather than the Creator," he continues, "Therefore, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lusts for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men and received in themselves the due penalty of their perversion."

A complete reading of these passages, in their original context, clearly shows that what Paul was actually referring to was homosexual temple prostitution, which was performed by various cults (though far more cults used heterosexual prostitution). Again, Paul is not referring to same-sex love, and he clearly has no concept of persons for whom this lifestyle is "natural."

Paul's other reference to homosexual acts in 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 is similar to 1 Timothy 1:8-11. These two passages contain lists of persons to be excluded from the Realm of God. The interpretation of these passages depends on two Greek words that have always presented a problem for translators. In the King James Version, they are translated "effeminate" and "abusers of themselves with mankind." In the Revised Standard Version, they were combined and rendered as "homosexuals," however, these are not the Greek words for homosexual, so these translations reflects the scholars' bias. The New International Version illustrates the difference in these two words by translating them "male prostitute" and "homosexual offenders." The Jerusalem Bible uses the terms "catamites and "sodomites." Catamites were youth kept especially for sexual purpose, who were usually paid large sums of money. Neither passage refers to persons of same-sex orientation but to people who used their sexuality for personal gain.

The Love of Christ
Jesus did a great deal to change many social customs and ideas. He elevated the position of women, and, ultimately, they were his best and most faithful disciples. He did this by example and by commandments that were absolutely inclusive of the rights of all people. Yet, in the name of the Christ whose love encompassed all, the Church has been the most homophobic of all institutions. This should not be surprising when we realize that the Church is still the largest institution which is primarily racially segregated.

The final, and central, message of the New Testament is that ALL persons are loved by God so much that God's Son was sent as a means of redemption from a disease by which we are all afflicted. The cure for this disease cannot be found in any set of actions. Neither homosexuality nor heterosexuality is redemptive. God's love through Christ was given to all people.

The Theological Reflection
For the Christian, sin must be understood as a disease that results FROM a broken relationship with God and that results IN a broken relationship with one another and with ourselves. Hence, Jesus' supreme command is to love God and to love our neighbors as we love ourselves. Christianity is not a religion with new rules and laws but rather is a new relationship with God. Those things that the legalists are fond of labeling "sins" are actually just symptoms of the much deeper disease of alienation and estrangement. Much of the energy of the Church has been spent dealing with symptoms while leaving the disease intact. Jesus did not seem overly concerned about the legal transgressions of those to whom he ministered. Rather, he was much more concerned with healing the physical, spiritual, emotional and relational brokenness of people. Perhaps if the Church would again give itself to the healing/reconciling ministry of Jesus, then some of the symptoms about which we are so concerned would begin to disappear.

That brings us to the question: Is homosexuality a symptom of brokenness? In a very few cases, perhaps. Yet, pointing fingers of blame and accusation is not Christ's way. Rather, Jesus accepted people as they were and allowed love and acceptance to work its miracle. However, most lesbians and gays have been lesbian or gay for as long as they can remember. For them, it is a much a natural characteristic as their eye color or their handedness. Kinsey Institute research (University of Indiana, 1981) has suggested that homosexuality may well be genetic or, at least, linked to some prenatal factors. (Sexual Preference, Bell &Weinberg) Certainly most competent psychologists would concur that sexual orientation is set prior to the age of five in most persons. It is, therefore, not a matter of choice, so it cannot be a moral or ethical issue.

Many Christians insist that God can change/cure the homosexual. In the book The Third Sex there are six reported cases of homosexuals whom God has "cured." Of these six, at least four are known to have returned to their gay lifestyle. (Christianity Today, February 1981) Many lesbians and gays spend most of their lives trying, with no success, to persuade God to change them. It is like trying to get God to change your eye color. What option, then, is left to these persons? They have been told that they can't be gay and Christian. Since all efforts have failed in their struggle not to be gay or lesbian, then their only recourse, according to the Church, is that they can't be Christian. So, the Church has discounted or discarded as much as 10% of the population.

If they are excluded from the life of the Christian community, who, then, will tell them of God's inclusive love and of Jesus' reconciling death? Are they left to assume that God is so narrow-minded as to exclude them for something over which they have no control and for a choice they did not make? When will the Church finally be brave enough to say with Paul, "in Christ there is neither Jew nor Greek, slave or free, male or female," gay or straight? God has enough love for all!
Korisnikov avatar
By Goran Smith
#229005
Originally posted by Angelina777
Hriscanski gejevi? Ovo je apsurdno!

I videh i gle! Siilan vetar dolazashe sa severa i velik oblak i oganj koji se razgorevashe i oko njega gnev boziji, a usred ognja jaka svetlost i to bese Gospod Bog, pored njega kao cetiri zivotinje oni sto semena muska van zene svoje na istopolna prosipashe, to behaju gresnici sodomasti koji na ochi behu nalik na coveka i noge im bejahu prave, a u stopalu behu im noge kao u teleta i sevahu kao ugladjena med. Tako i vi sijate homoseksualci, a stopala vam odaju greh.

Gresnici, pokrijte lica pred prizorom Svesilnoga, jer ste nemocni da podnesete munju njegova gneva koja se odapinje sa trona bozjijeg :meduza: kao i blistanje koje se odasilje otud. Ta blistanja, svetlost, munja celom svetu pokazuju na bezakonje vase i sramotu svoju ne mozete prikriti. Gospod vas moli da se pokajete jer ne zeli svoju decu koja su se sva rodjenjem prokazala u Hristu da baci na muke vechne! Pokajte se, dok jos nije kasno!

Sam naziv sajta kristijan gejs govori da to nije od boga napisano. Djavo je mudar.I uchi vas odgovorima.

Al andio bozji silazi s neba:sw:ovako cete se provesti!
Originally posted by Angelina777
To je sud djavla. Sveto pismo je direktno od Boga napisano, a to sto 2/3 gresnika ne veruje, oni ce u pakao ici i to nije problem crkve osim da ih na pravi put vrati. Bas zato sto je toliko mulja i taloga na zemlji, Gospod se sprema da svet unisti jer je to seme zita bacheno u zemlju donelo kukolj. Vera je coveku urodjena. Kad je nema, djavo je umesao prste u to. Ne dokazuje vera postojanje bozje,ali se ona dokazuje njime, jer polazi od njega. Eto vam dokaza. I sad? Sta cete sad? Ne bojite se pakla? MOzda negirate Veru? A ona je osnov svega cemu se nadamo, potvrda stvari nevidljivih, znaci POSTOJI! u tROJICI SE POJMI PRIRODA I ZIVE PUNOCOM, ali nisu iz iste prirode, vec su iste prirode. A kakve veze VI imate s prirodom?

?itaju?i postove Angeline, došao sam do zaklju?ka da A. nije vernica SPC :wow:
Koliko sam upoznat, svaki vernik SPC, poštuje veru i verovanje drugih religija, jer je i sama SPC izjavila, a to je i u?enje Svetog Pisma, da postoji puno na?ina kako da se doðe do Boga. Kako A.777 uporno govori kako se do Boga samo može do?i preko pravoslavne-hriš?anske crkve i da je jedini na?in da homoseksualci doðu do Raja posle smrti egzekucijom, tj. isterivanjem ðavola... uvideo sam da je A.777 ?lanica neke satanisti?ke sekte, koja sigurno posle obreda kolje koze
Korisnikov avatar
By Super Mario
#229075
Originally posted by unic0rn
A na ovoj strani, http://www.wpro.who.int/pdf/pub/33/module4.pdf
Svetska Zdravstvena Organizacija ne klasifikuje homosexualnost kao bolest nego kao nesto sasvim normalno.


hajde da vidimo sta ima u toj klasifikaciji kojom mashesh:

A cause for homosexuality or bisexuality may never be found,
but we have to ask ourselves some very serious questions. Firstly, does
homosexuality or bisexuality have to be considered as a pathology? If not, then
why are scientists looking for a cause for homosexuality and bisexuality, but not
heterosexuality? The presumption is that heterosexuality is the normal, natural
strana br 13

etoo, lepo oni kazhu sta je normalno i prirodno!
:crkla:
Korisnikov avatar
By unic0rn
#229326
gox
Ma šta se femkate više,šta ima da im objašnjavam,ne?u da mi se vataju i cma?u po ulicama homoseksualci i kraj.
Kažite mi bar jedan dobar razlog zašto bi "trebalo" da se žvalavite na sred grada.
Iz istih razloga kao i heterosexualci.
Angelina777
Hriscanski gejevi? Ovo je apsurdno!

I videh i gle! Siilan vetar dolazashe sa severa i velik oblak i oganj koji se razgorevashe i oko njega gnev boziji, a usred ognja jaka svetlost i to bese Gospod Bog, pored njega kao cetiri zivotinje oni sto semena muska van zene svoje na istopolna prosipashe, to behaju gresnici sodomasti koji na ochi behu nalik na coveka i noge im bejahu prave, a u stopalu behu im noge kao u teleta i sevahu kao ugladjena med. Tako i vi sijate homoseksualci, a stopala vam odaju greh.

Gresnici, pokrijte lica pred prizorom Svesilnoga, jer ste nemocni da podnesete munju njegova gneva koja se odapinje sa trona bozjijeg :meduza: kao i blistanje koje se odasilje otud. Ta blistanja, svetlost, munja celom svetu pokazuju na bezakonje vase i sramotu svoju ne mozete prikriti. Gospod vas moli da se pokajete jer ne zeli svoju decu koja su se sva rodjenjem prokazala u Hristu da baci na muke vechne! Pokajte se, dok jos nije kasno!

Sam naziv sajta kristijan gejs govori da to nije od boga napisano. Djavo je mudar.I uchi vas odgovorima.

Al andio bozji silazi s neba:sw:ovako cete se provesti!
Isus je doshao na zemlju i dao zivot za grehove svih.
Doshao je da promovishe ljubav i jednakost.
Vi direktno krshite njegovo uchenje i chinite greh dokazujuci da je nesto drugo greh.

Shto se tiche Biblije..

Bibiliju su napisali ljudi koji su promovisali svoja sopstvena verska uverenja. Ziveli su pre 2000 godina i naravno da nemaju dodira s modernim drustvom. Pitanje je da li su imali dodira uopste sa tadasnjom civilizacijom ili su ceo zivot proveli u pecini ili kao Mojsije na planini i pisali sta im se svidelo.
Za njih su, ropstvo, masovna ubistva, genocid i represija prema zenama sasvim normalni i to se moze naci u Bibliji. Danas je to svuda veliki greh zar ne?

Ispitivanje homosexualnosti nije pochelo pre 1950 godine i stoga autori Biblije nemaju nikakvog pojma o onome o chemu pishu. Zashto su oni to uvrstili na Bibiliju to je vec druga pricha. Ljudi verovatno ziveli u (ne)namernom celibatu pa su sve vrste sexa proglasili grehom. Napominjem da je po njima i heterosex opcenje i homosex opcenje greh. Mislim da to dovoljno govori o svemu. Po tom pitanju smo svi greshni.

I kada vec chitamo Bibiliju u vezi ove teme mislim da bi vaznije bilo obratiti paznju na vrednosti koje promovishe Biblija poput: pravda, ljubav, monogamija, briznost, posvecenost. Svega toga ima i u heterosexualnom i homosexualnom odnosu podjednako.

Citat:

A cause for homosexuality or bisexuality may never be found,
but we have to ask ourselves some very serious questions. Firstly, does
homosexuality or bisexuality have to be considered as a pathology? If not, then
why are scientists looking for a cause for homosexuality and bisexuality, but not
heterosexuality? The presumption is that heterosexuality is the normal, natural


strana br 13

etoo, lepo oni kazhu sta je normalno i prirodno!
:crkla:
Nisi svrshio do kraja. Da ti 'dam ruku' :
But this does not explain the fact that siblings,
even twins, brought up by the same parents, may grow up to have different
sexual orientations (e.g. one heterosexual, another homosexual). The
approaches to causation are often referred to as the "nature/nurture" arguments.

Talking about finding a cause for homosexuality or bisexuality is about
as useful as wanting to find the cause of why some people will develop to be
innately artistic, or political, or hardworking. The dangers could lead to
discrimination, the re-pathologizing of sexual orientation, and even the
elimination of such potential people in future generations through abortion.
Da pojasnim neupucenima.
Izvukao si rechenicu iz konteksta koja uopste ne znachi to sto ti hoces da znachi. To je manipulacija.

Oni prichaju o svim istrazivanjima na tu temu (pa i o gej genima) i kazu da je izmedju ostalog u nekim istrazivanjima koriscena gorepomenuta pretpostavka...

Dakle, izvuko si iz konteksta...

:crkla: :crkla:
By RACABG
#229649
Ja hocu da nasledim penziju od partnera zato mi to zakon ne dozvoljava:iskolacen:
Korisnikov avatar
By Super Mario
#230287
Iz unicornove sveske:
Talking about finding a cause for homosexuality or bisexuality is about
as useful as wanting to find the cause of why some people will develop to be
innately artistic, or political, or hardworking
Kao sto se vidi, chovek se mozhe razviti u homoseksualca samo ako su socijalni faktori povoljnim jer ma koliko imao "urodjenog talenta" (preduslova) da postane umetnik, nece to i ostvariti dokle god se ne usavrasva , obrazuje i usmerava ka cilju.

Isto je i sa pederlukom- Sve i da postoje predisopozicije, one se mogu inhibirati u cilju dobrobiti drustva i nacije.

Unicorne, ako vec hoces da citiras, onda mi citraj rechenicu iz te "sveske" u kojoj se jasno istiche neophodnost jednakosti homoseksualca i heteroseksualca :freddy:
:hand: :freddy:
Korisnikov avatar
By Super Mario
#230291
Originally posted by RACABG
Ja hocu da nasledim penziju od partnera zato mi to zakon ne dozvoljava:iskolacen:
A ja hocu da nasledim penziju Donalda Trampa, ali mi zakon to ne dozovljava :sleep:
Korisnikov avatar
By Super Mario
#230301
Za gorana, citati iz Novosti:

"Da je Bog hteo da decu raðaju muškarci, on ne bi stvorio ženu, niti bi na Nojevu barku stavio muško i žensko od svake vrste, da se množe i napune svet - kaže profesor Kalezi?. Uostalom, sve je u prirodi tako postavljeno: ne oprašuju se cvetovi iste vrste, niti se razmnožavaju životinje istog pola. "

http://www.novosti.co.yu/vest.php?vest=17143&rubrika=Društvo

Za unicorna:
Tek ispred pisoara po?inje njihova igra. Javni toaleti omiljeno su mesto beogradskih homoseksualaca. Dok vrše nuždu gledaju jedan drugog ispod pojasa. Namiguju, prilaze, gurkaju se, pipaju, ljube, pa odlaze u kabinu.

prochitaj i ispovest babasere u istom tekstu
VIKENDOM ih je manje. Najve?a gužva je preko nedelje, oko 11 ujutru i nagrnu kad se posle radnog vremena vra?aju sa posla. Ve?ina njih ima žene i porodice. Jednog doktora koji redovno dolazi ovde zbog "onih stvari", srela sam sa ženom i decom u parku i prepoznala ga. Pokazivao mi je o?ima da ?utim - ispri?ala nam je radnica u toaletu iz prolaza u Nuši?evoj ulici, koja na tom mestu radi 19 godina. - Homoseksualci su veoma agresivni. Deset puta su me napdali, pa se više ne svaðam sa njima.
http://www.novosti.co.yu/vest.php?vest=34763&rubrika=Beograd.

i vama je to normlano? Ljubav u klozetu? :wcsolja:
Korisnikov avatar
By Super Mario
#230348
Originally posted by unic0rn
Da pojasnim neupucenima.
Izvukao si rechenicu iz konteksta koja uopste ne znachi to sto ti hoces da znachi. To je manipulacija.

Oni prichaju o svim istrazivanjima na tu temu (pa i o gej genima) i kazu da je izmedju ostalog u nekim istrazivanjima koriscena gorepomenuta pretpostavka...

Dakle, izvuko si iz konteksta...

:crkla: :crkla:
Svima je jasno sta pishe tamo. To sto ti se ne dopada, nije moj problem. I ljubazno te molim da prekinesh tu propagandu, deca ovo chitaju . Zbunices ih

:cita:

:zvezda:
Korisnikov avatar
By Mr Dee
#230383
Mario, ne mozes tako da razmisljas. To nije sustina. To je isto kao kad bih ja uzeo primer nekog ubice koji je heteroseksualan, pa na osnovu toga zakljucio kako sve homoseksualce treba istrebiti jer su svi takvi. Uostalom, niko ne treba da ima toliku kontrolu nad tudjim zivotima, pa cak ni nad zivotima svoje dece. Ljudska bica nisu posed niti su masine koje mozes tek tako programirati zeljenim paternima ponasanja. To sto se tebi ne svidja to sto neke osobe rade po toaletima, to je tvoja stvar. Niko tebe ne primorava da i ti to radis. Licno znam heteroseksualne parove koji to isto rade. Neke to posebno pali, neki to rade zbog nedostatka prostora, a bilo kako bilo banalizovati strast, osecanja izmedju dva ljudska bica na ovaj nacin je stvarno ruzno.
Korisnikov avatar
By Mr Dee
#230391
Originally posted by Super Mario
Originally posted by RACABG
Ja hocu da nasledim penziju od partnera zato mi to zakon ne dozvoljava:iskolacen:
A ja hocu da nasledim penziju Donalda Trampa, ali mi zakon to ne dozovljava :sleep:
Pa zato sto doticnog u zivotu nisi video, a jos manje si mu bio zena, muz ili dete. Mislim ko tebi onda daje pravo da nasledis penziju ili stan ili sta vec od svoje zene?To nije tvoje zar ne? Zasto bi ti to nasledio? zato sto si muz? Da li te to izjednacava sa tvojom zenom? Ukoliko ti imas prava na to, tj. ukoliko zakon tebi omogucava takve opcije, zasto ne bi omogucio i nekom homoseksualnom paru?
Korisnikov avatar
By Super Mario
#230398
Originally posted by Mr Dee
a bilo kako bilo banalizovati strast, osecanja izmedju dva ljudska bica na ovaj nacin je stvarno ruzno.
Pa da li ih mi teramo da rade "one stvari" u wc-u? Za sve smo mi krivi :kopa:
Korisnikov avatar
By Mr Dee
#230399
Originally posted by Super Mario
Za gorana, citati iz Novosti:

"Da je Bog hteo da decu raðaju muškarci, on ne bi stvorio ženu, niti bi na Nojevu barku stavio muško i žensko od svake vrste, da se množe i napune svet - kaže profesor Kalezi?. Uostalom, sve je u prirodi tako postavljeno: ne oprašuju se cvetovi iste vrste, niti se razmnožavaju životinje istog pola. "

http://www.novosti.co.yu/vest.php?vest=17143&rubrika=Društvo
Covek je stvorio boga, a ne bog coveka.

Seksualnost nema blage veze sa radjanjem dece, i ne znam zasto se stalno pozivate na to. Pitam se koliko bi 'normalci' sa simpatijama gledali na zabranu i ostro kaznjavanje svih seksualnih aktivnosti koje nemaju nikakve veze sa zacinjanjem dece. Za pocetak bi trebalo zabraniti poljupce. zaboga, usta je bog stvorio da bi se u njih unosila hrana, ljubljenje je greh.
Korisnikov avatar
By Mr Dee
#230408
Originally posted by Super Mario
Originally posted by Mr Dee
a bilo kako bilo banalizovati strast, osecanja izmedju dva ljudska bica na ovaj nacin je stvarno ruzno.
Pa da li ih mi teramo da rade "one stvari" u wc-u? Za sve smo mi krivi :kopa:
A ja sam mislio da tebe zapravo ne interesuje gde, ko i sa kim ima sex, sve dok je to daleko od tvojih ociju?


Evo da upotrebim tvoje metode:
Originally posted by Super Mario
Za sve smo mi krivi
Pokajte se za vase grehove!
Korisnikov avatar
By Super Mario
#230411
Originally posted by Mr Dee
Zasto bi ti to nasledio? zato sto si muz? Da li te to izjednacava sa tvojom zenom? Ukoliko ti imas prava na to, tj. ukoliko zakon tebi omogucava takve opcije, zasto ne bi omogucio i nekom homoseksualnom paru?
Pa hajde, ako je sve tako, zasto onda nije zakonom odobreno? Zasto!? :cul: Chak ni u Americi, gde je gejstvo normalno!
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long long title how many chars? lets see 123 ok more? yes 60

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